Wednesday, June 8, 2011

PG admissions

I have been receiving emails enquiring about the differences between our M.Sc (Engg) program, M.E program of IISc and M.Tech programs of IIT. M.Sc (Engg) is similar to the M.S. programs offered by some IITs like IIT-M and is a research program.  The M.E. program of IISc is similar to the M.Tech programs of IITs and is largely course based.

In IISc, a candidate for M.Sc (Engg) takes 12 to 18 credits of course work while a M.E./M.Tech student takes nearly 32-40 credits of course work. The more course work enables a M.E. student to pick up more basics and understand the fundamentals better. The average time for graduation for M.Sc (Engg) and M.E. in IISc is 2 years, 5 months and 2 years, respectively.

My advice: If you get admission to M.Tech in a major IIT with a good research program, choose it over M.Sc (Engg), unless you really want to do research, in which case the latter is better.


Anonymous said...

Sir, can an M.Sc(Engg) student audit a few courses of his choice in IISc?

Anonymous said...

yes, if it agreed by research supervisor and instructor. but some supervisors do not agree because it delays thesis submission.

Anonymous said...

Sir, what is the procedure for converting MSc(Engg)to Phd at IISc?

Giri@iisc said...

If you have a CGPA of 5.5/8 or more, you can upgrade to Ph.D after an interview. You can do it anytime before your thesis defence but you will be not given your M.Sc degree. The other option is conversion, which you can do just after you submit your thesis. Again you have to appear for an interview. In this case, you will get your M.Sc degree.

Anonymous said...

Thank you sir for that very useful information

bharatindian said...

in the original post you said "My advice: If you get admission to M.Tech in a major IIT with a good research program, choose it over M.Sc (Engg), unless you really want to do research, in which case the latter is better"

Why you say so. IISc is considered to be at par with foreign universities but IITs do not have good research environment and also are not well known for research. Only the undergraduate studies are the best over there.

I am asking this because I got M.Tech in IIT delhi in a deparment which only includes post graduate and Phd students and is known for research (its actually a centre for research)and I am planning to chose MSc(Engg.) of IISC over it or any project associate position in IISc because I think if its research then its only IISc in India otherwise nothing.

Is my thinking proper? If not please enlighten me?

Giri@iisc said...

" IISc is considered to be at par with foreign universities but IITs do not have good research environment and also are not well known for research. Only the undergraduate studies are the best over there."

What an insult to IITs. Have you taken the time and looked at the research publications or output from IITs? OR do you go by what a minister says?

Many IITs compare well with IISc in terms of number of publications, citations etc. We are also comparing a M.Tech course with M.Sc Engg course. Also, as I wrote, unless you are really interested in a research career, then a M.Tech is better is because you will take 32 credits of course work, learn more etc. and do one year project and WILL graduate in two years. A MSc (Engg) program may take three years to complete and I do not think job opportunities or any other prospect is better than a M.Tech from a good IIT. Just my opinion..


Anonymous said...

Sir, the chem engg dept has published a tentative list of selected candidates ( officially, will we get the confirmed admission letter from the department/institution?

Anonymous said...

Thanks, Professor Giridhar. As a faculty in IIT, it is rare to find a faculty from IISc who will acknowledge IITs and agree that research quality in IITs is good. As you have pointed out elsewhere, IIT-B and IIT-M, IIT-G, IIT-K have nearly doubled their publication output in the last ten years.

This issue is entirely different. How can one compare a course program, M.Tech, to a research program, M.Sc (Engg)? Typically, we also have M.S. programs in IITs and the students who join there are students who have not got into our M.Tech program. The course load is lower and supposedly the research component is higher but the placement of M.Tech is better and the research training of M.Tech students is also better.

Therefore, I would go a step further and say even if you are interested in research, a M.Tech in IIT is better than M.S in IIT or M.Sc (Engg) in IISc. You can always convert or go to Ph.D and, more importantly, you will finish in two years. If you are really interested in research, join for a direct Ph.D and do not join for a M.S.

M from IIT

Anonymous said...

Sir, for ME courses,is the duration 2 years and 5 months? I had an impression tht MSc courses hd more duration than ME courses!!

Giri@iisc said...

Please read the post carefully. The duration is 2 years, 5 months for M.Sc (Engg) and 2 years for M.E.

Anonymous said...

If I want to pursue doctrate,which would be better,MSc engg / ME. what are the prospects if I would prefer doctrate outside India?

Anonymous said...

Irrespective of whether you want to pursue doctorate abroad or in India, a M.Tech would be better than M.Sc (Engg). Of course, the M.Tech should be either from IIT or IISc.

Anonymous said...

let me clarify a few things. an msc(engg) student can theoretically take up to 12 courses(36 credits), although the minimum requirement is 4 courses. i am an msc student and have taken 8 courses. an msc student is allowed to take courses in the 1st 2 semesters. ME students usually do around 13-16 courses spread over 3-4 semesters. ME project lasts around 8 months, whereas an msc project lasts around 1.5-2 years.

misinfo such as mtech better than msc or even vice versa must not be spread. it is completely dependent on the student to decide what he/she wants. if one wants to spend more time studying courses then one can go for mtech/ME and if one wants to spend more time doing research then one can go for msc/ms.

my advice: one can learn the subjects from books probably better than what is taught in courses due to the time constraints(each course consists of around 45 teaching hours in 1 sem).

if one is more interested in things like conducting experiments, reading up literature, developing code, compared to giving courses, one should prefer msc over ME, else if it is the other way around he should go for ME.

regarding the post masters job scenario, in my case i think msc will help me to find a better job compared to ME as i have spent almost 9 months developing code, reading up on current literature, practices, etc, and i still have around 1 year to go. there is a demand for coders in my field and msc is thus better in my case. something which would not have been possible in ME as the project duration lasts only around 9 months. in most of the cases for ME they have to pack up on unfinished projects due to the time constraints.

also post msc, phd opportunities would be better as you would be having a better CV with more publications.

the most important part is msc is choosing the guide and the field

Anonymous said...

I think a direct Ph.D is better if you are interested in research. A direct Ph.D after B.E. will take 5 years while M.Sc (Engg) will take 2.5 years and then 4 more years for Ph.D

Giri@iisc said...


I do not know who is spreading misinfo. The maximum number of credits a M.Sc (Engg) student can take is 18 and not 36. Look in the student handbook. This will be strictly enforced effective this year. In fact, now both DCC and research supervisor has to agree if more than 18 credits have to be taken. Further, I fail to understand if a M.Sc (Engg) student takes 12 courses for two semesters, how can he do research for 1.5 years?

In the chemical engineering department, the student does courses only in the first two semesters and devotes the rest of the time for project. M.E. students start the project in May and finish in July and I have no idea how you get 8 months for a project.

Anonymous said...


i don't get what you are saying

i'm am an msc student. have done 8 courses. and will eventually do research for maybe more than 1.5 years

have i done something wrong!!

Anonymous said...

and i have many friends who are msc and have done in and around around 8 courses and will eventually do 1.5 years research.

+ i hope you are not victimizing me or something for expressing my views on me vs msc. i have just said that it is completely dependent on the coice of the student. i haven't said anything inflammatory. you cvan always delete the comments if they are against the spirit of this blog

Anonymous said...

Re ME project:

students here are required to do 15 courses. some of my friends have done 17. so 3 semesters will get completely consumed with coursework. the leaves behind around 6 months + 2 months (from the previous summer vacation to get the project work started).

i've approximately said that it is around 8-9 months. and i know that it is correct

Giri@iisc said...

So far, we have not strictly enforced the maximum 18 credit limit for (engg) students but this will be done in the near future. Students taking 8 courses, especially in electrical sciences, and then doing research for 1.5 years leads to the degree being 2.5 years. The date of cancellation of M.Sc registration is also 2.5 years. Thus, many students take 2.5 years or more when the scholarship is only for two years. In order to bring down the time for graduation to around 2 years, strict limits will be enforced on the number of courses one can take in case of M.Sc (Engg).

Also, when you say m.e student here is required to take 15 courses, I do not know what here means. It could mean your department. But many departments have a limit of 40 credits for course work. Why don't you post the minimum and maximum course credit requirements for ME for various departments. In chemical engg, it is 32 and 36. So, everyone does not take 15 or 17 courses.

I have also written that a engg is better if one is interested in research.

It is so surprising that you claim that I am victimizing you when I do not know you are while you know who I am. It is really a pity that when a faculty does not agree with a student, the student claims he/she is victimized !

Thanks and best wishes,


Anonymous said...

"an msc(engg) student can theoretically take up to 12 courses(36 credits), although the minimum requirement is 4 courses."

The minimum requirement is 12 credits and the maximum is NOT 36 credits. This is completely untrue. I challenge the student to show an official handbook of IISc where a maximum of 36 credits is mentioned.

Anonymous said...

Well, instead of challenging, I decided to post the credit requirements from the IISc handbook.

Clearly, shows 18 credits is the maximum credit for M.Sc (Engg). Deans never implemented this strictly and I am glad some initiative is being taken by IISc now to implement this. Will this reduce the time to graduate?

Anonymous said...

@prof giri

u said "i do not know who is spreading misinfo" and it was targeted at me. ok maybe victimization was a strong word!. anyway my intentions were just to inform prospective students about me vs msc and nothing more.

anyway my misinfo remark was not targeted at prof giridhar but targeted at this statement "Therefore, I would go a step further and say even if you are interested in research, a M.Tech in IIT is better than M.S in IIT or M.Sc (Engg) in IISc"

the above statement is completely untrue. there is little use of fighting over whether iisc is better than iits or vice versa. things finally come down completely to the lab/prof in which you get to work and nothing else.

ok i will put up the numbers for two departments as i know they are true.

msc : min 4 courses, max 12 courses
(2 sems, but people who are not able to get 5.5 in best of 4 subjects end up doing 1 or 2 courses in 3rd sem also)

me: min 13 courses, max 18 courses

msc: min 4 courses, max 12 courses
(2 sems, but people who are not able to get 5.5 in best of 4 subjects end up doing 1 or 2 courses in 3rd sem also)

me: min 15 courses, max 18 courses

@prof giridhar

regarding scholarships

due to the difficulties faced by msc students with regards to the funding, the scholarship of Rs 8000 has been extended for the 1st 2.5 years, and pension of Rs3000 for the period 2.5/=-3 years. hence funding now exists for the 1st 3 years.

Anonymous said...

not all statements in the iisc rule book are true. it is written that a reseach student needs 6 cgpa to pass, but the reality is 5.5

it is written that research students can do courses for only the 1st sem and need special permission to do courses in the 2nd sem. but the real rule is research students can do courses for the 1st 2 sems and need special permission to do courses in the 3rd sem.

also at the person claiming that mtech from iit is better than ms/msc, i got offered me,mtech from iisc iits but i preferred to do msc or would have even preferred ms compared to mtech as it is a better program for me as i'm more research oriented(subjects can be read from textbooks anyways)

Anonymous said...

sorry for typo

2.5-3 years, pension of Rs 3000

Anonymous said...

this is a very good write can be extrapolated to other branches of engg also , but similar logic applies

Anonymous said...

from your webapage, you have graduated 11 M.Sc (Engg) and 21 M.E. students. Who do you find better, on average?

Anonymous said...

Sir, I want to know whether the average time to finish PHD for Mtech student and Btech student is same or different?

Rupinder said...

Hello Sir,i want to know that how much gate score is required to get admission( in IISC.
Rupinderjit Singh

Anonymous said...

99 percentile in GATE exam,is the thumb rule!!!

Abhishek said...

@prof GIRI,
Sir, i have been offered MS at IISC in aerospace dept(controls), and also in controls and computing in IIT-B.. Regarding the choice of subjects, I would be studying Controls in both my choices.I am interested to get into industry. I have heard that the environment in IISC is such that most of the MS students go on to do their Phd. My question is that, is it because of lack of opportunities after MS? And what would be your suggestion, taking into consideration the job opportunities after the course.

Thank You

Anonymous said...

He has already written about MS and ME and how to choose. I think if he says anything more, some student in IISc will claim he is victimized by the blog ! I think that is why he has stopped writing and advising.

Anonymous said...

Sir, what are the industrial job opportunities after M.Sc(Engg)? Can a person go to the industry and work rather than as a researcher or academician?

What kind of jobs are available in India after M.Sc(Engg) in Signal Processing?

Harish said...

Hello Sir,, can you please clarify what is the basic difference between the courses ME and MTECH??? There is an apti and a PI for MTECH but no such thing for ME. Why is it so for MTECH??
Thanks in advance Giri Sir..