Sunday, March 22, 2009

Pay scales in IISc

There has been a lot of discussion in the comments section of my previous post on the pay actually obtained by professors in IIT/IISc. There has been confusion because the website of IISc and some other places advertise only the basic pay.

However, the scale without mentioning the allowances and other benefits is misleading. Please note the new sixth pay commission pay has not yet been fixed for faculty in IIT/IISc but it can be assured that it will not be less than that of UGC. Based on the document provided by IIT-M for pay fixation and by UGC, here are the details that a professor in IISc actually earns,

Basic + Grade Pay : 57,000 (52,000 for associate professor; 38,000 for assistant professor)
Dearness allowance (DA) as on 1 March 2009 (22%) : 11,000
House Rent Allowance, HRA (30% of B+GP+DA): 22,000
Travelling Allowance (TA): 3,200 + 15% of DA
Academic Allowance : 1,500
Telephone : 1,500

All the above are provided without submission of bills. HRA will be paid to employees who do not stay in quarters provided by IISc/IIT. It does not matter whether the employee is actually staying in an own house or paying rent. The travelling allowance will be paid to all employees even if they stay in the quarters.

The total of the above comes to around 90,000 for a professor and 60,000 for an assistant professor. 10% of the basic + GP is contributed by the institute and 10% is deducted from the salary for future retirement benefits. Thus, the pretax income is around 85000 and 55000 for a professor and assistant professor, respectively. The Dearness allowance increases based on inflation and increases by 6-7 percent every year. In addition, there is an increment of 3 percent every year.

In addition, they are benefits that are provided only if it is claimed. This includes children education allowance, subsidy for single girl child, Leave travel concession for the whole family every year,medical benefits to the family, travel money for attending conferences etc. If one counts all this, the cost to the institution (CTC) is around Rs. 15 lakhs per year for each professor. In addition, one can get fellowships that vary from Rs 60,000 to Rs 6 lakhs per year from DST/DBT, depending on the fellowships. In addition, if one is a fellow of two academies or has won the Bhatnagar award, one would get Rs. 1.8 lakh per year till retirement. Roughly 30% of the teaching faculty in IISc get these.

The amount obtained by consultancy also varies from faculty to faculty with some faculty getting close to Rs 20 lakhs per year. For consultancy, the faculty receives 60% of the amount while the institute takes 40% as overheads. This may be revised in the sixth pay commission.

Further, each faculty is given vacation for three months every year where he/she can travel/work anywhere and earn whatever money.

It is best to stick with CTC for comparison. One becomes a professor after 10-12 years after joining with a postdoc. This translates to 12-14 years after obtaining a Ph.D. How does this compare to pay scales in the rest of the government and industry?

Currently, professors are in the S-29 scale of 18,400- . After 10 years as professor, one can become a professor of eminence at the S-31 scale of 22,400-. Above that is the director scale (S-33) of 26,000 (fixed), which is equivalent to the secretary scale. This is the highest scale in IIT/IISc. Above this, there is only scale in the government, which is the cabinet secretary scale (S-34) of 30,000. This is the scale that a director general of CSIR, DST/DBT secretary (all technical positions) gets and is the highest in the government. Thus, a regular professor in IIT/IISc is three scales below the highest scale offered in the government.

In IITs (unlike the US), the salary for a professor in humanities or sciences or engineering is the same. This makes comparison of pay scales to industry difficult because the pay differential between these branches of study is considerable in industry. Based on this, I presume the CTC for a doctorate after 14 years of service would be around Rs. 25-30 lakhs per annum.

There is one more component that I should mention. The retirement age for all purposes is now 70. However, if I retire (hopefully !) from IISc in 2019 after 20 years of service at the age of 50, I will get pension for the rest of my life at 50% of the basic that I get at 2019. The pension will increase with increase in DA. Of course, this will not be applicable if one works in a private industry.

For the current employees of IIT/IISc: Arrears and the pay fixation in the new pay scale can be calculated from this document made by Dr. Ramesh of IIT-M. I know him when both of us were involved in GATE administration and software development. I can vouch for the thoroughness and correctness of his software !

33 comments:

Nilesh Sawarkar said...

Professor

Again thanks for your immediate posting. I agree that IISc needs to advertise total emoluments. Also the way the emoluments are advertised needs some change. For instance, most people who have never had parents/ siblings in the public sector (like me) have no clue what DA means or what TA is. What is useful information is this:
Assistant Professor (Most Important position since most fresh postdocs/ PhDs apply for this position)
Cash compensation per month without having to separately fill out forms as Balaji pointed out (which I was unaware of):
Retirement benefits - What this means and when this can be withdrawn
If you don't avail of quarters how much more do you cash in:

The cash they will receive per month is VERY important to most young people. Apparently disposable income is something many in the IT sector who get out to do PhDs are used to and they would like to know that they can sustain a similar lifestyle.

Such a simplified table would be invaluable. I am trying to convince 2 researchers that I know to return to work in an IIT, and they told me that they got offered more than twice that amount(the 12K for an Asst. Prof.) when they worked for Infosys immediately out of college! One of them is willing to accept a much less prestigious position even though he is immensely qualified - such a clear posting would help attract top people to institutes like yours. Clearly, as your record has shown, one can do world class research at IISc. It would be nice to know that one can live a world-class lifestyle too.

Thanks again, and keep blogging!

Anonymous said...

Why do you want to retire when you are fifty when you are so active? You should work till retirement for full pension, no?

Giri@iisc said...

Nilesh: I have modified the post to answer your questions.

To Anon: I would like to retire at 50 and sit at my home in the Himalayas !

Anonymous said...

Nilesh: Your friends are deliberately lying. How can they say an assistant professor gets 12K. The Ph.D students in IISc get 15,000 while post doc there gets 25,000.

Nilesh Sawarkar said...

Professor,

Thanks, this is indeed helpful. Your diligence in putting forth these numbers is much appreciated.

Anon,

My 'friends' are not lying. They are merely quoting the IISc Website. If they misunderstand, it's not their fault - it's just that public sector payscales are confusing to most. And you seem to know that PhD students get 15K -- makes me wonder if you are a faculty member at IISc or IIT!

Giri@iisc said...

Dear Nilesh,

Your friends can not be at fault when even economic times thinks assistant professors get Rs. 12000.

The same IISc web site mentions that Ph.D students get 14,000 and post doc get 25,000. So, one can know these numbers without being a faculty :-)

Thanks

Giridhar

Balaji Ramasubramanian said...

Thanks a lot Prof. Giri,

This indeed encourages me to come back to my home country after my post-doc here in the US. I would want to live in India and teach my own country men. I was worried however that this is not possible with the pay-scales. Your post is surely encouraging.

As Nilesh Sawarkar says, it is a good tabulation. There are a few more things I'd really like:
1. A sort of comparison of pay-scales in industry and in academia with similar qualifications and years of experience. Otherwise it will be like comparing apples with oranges. A good comparison with living costs is also important. For example, a professor at highest pay scale in Delhi or Bangalore may have to spend far more than a professor in Madras. Since you have done a lot of survey of this, I request you to post some more. Indeed such information will be invaluable to people considering academic jobs in India.
2. IISc/IITs and other good research universities/institutes in India should advertise this well. There is just no excuse for not doing so. This is a very attractive pay.
3. In the US, surely a PhD in industry earns a little more than a PhD in academia. In India, there are hardly any openings in industry for PhDs. These people often end up as senior managers in large corporations participating in no research at all. In the US, however a PhD joins as a research scientist sometimes in collaboration with academia as a post-doc and gets to do a lot of research work while earning tons of money. This is obviously very attractive. Is there a way in which a similar thing could happen in India?

Who says that PhD students earn 15K in IISc? My brother is in IISc and is doing his PhD in Material Sciences. He gets 8K per month and when the IISc mess recently went on strike he sent an SOS message to my father to buy food. He told me that the pay would increase to a maximum of 12K in the coming years. For a living cost of Bangalore, that is abject pay, because he does not want my father to pay his annual tuition. He has to save on rent to pay his own tuition. I hope there is no income tax on the amount paid to students!

One of the major problems that prevents graduate students from pursuing their education in India is that just after a BTech a person in industry could earn significantly more than the universities could offer as a stipend. This is obviously the case even in the US, though the disparity is slightly lesser because of the fact that fresh graduates in industry are also paid only about USD 30-40k. A graduate student is covered for tuition upto about USD 30k and in addition gets a salary of about USD 25k p.a. (and increases with cost of living and annual increments are also there). The total coverage is very good. You also get a very good medical and dental coverage plan and most universities have good free medical resources within the campus. Further, grad school in the US is a real job - even for US citizens. This means that you can get married and have children while in graduate school and some good schools cover your spouse and children too. You are a completely independent earning member of your family and are no longer a burden to your parents. This is not true in India. For PhD students in the US there are extra allowances that apply and these vary across universities. My school covers leave travel upto USD 1k annually (subject to presenting bills) and covers your dependent spouse and children for upto USD 1k per head per month. This is in addition to the grad student salary.

Even NUS in Singapore pays $3000 per month to their graduate students (plus full tuition waiver). That is a lot of money - their average graduate student lives almost luxuriously. In Switzerland the average graduate student get 3000 francs per month - that is a huge sum.

Contrast all this to the average student at IISc. He still has to pay the tuition fees (annually about Rs. 24k) even if you are paid 8k per month - tuition is not waived. I'd say that if a graduate student in IISc is paid 8-12k per month with full tuition and rent waiver, that matches up to what the industry pays. This will significantly increase the general interest in getting a master's degree at least.

Again to increase the number of PhD applicants, you should significantly increase the salary of PhD students, waive off rent and any tuition (in IISc I hear there is no coursework during PhD, so I expect there should be no tuition fee and in that case, pay the student a lot more), cover expenses of spouse and children if any and pay some travel allowance. Only then will there be any significant interest in doing a PhD in Indian universities.

I know a close friend of mine (my batch from college) who completed her master's from IISc in 2006 and is now getting married. She got a job in the same organization where I worked and earned two scales lesser than me. I advised her to pursue her PhD and that this job was an insult to her abilities and she told me about the pay scale for PhD students in IISc. Right now, she is going to join NUS as a PhD student provided her husband gets a job in Singapore. I even know her husband very well (also my batch in college). He did his master's at TIFR and is also contemplating a PhD in NUS if he can't get a job there directly.

This is an unfortunate state of affairs - our smart children have to leave the country to pursue graduate education.

Thinking of Returning said...

Dear Professor,
In your post titled "Why blog?", you mention that:

"while another newspaper report says that IIT faculty can expect an 200% hike in salary with the basic salary going up from 12,000 to 37,000. These reports are factually wrong. The current salary for an assistant professor is 12,000 basic + 124% of dearness pay and dearness allowance. These are being merged into the new scale and thus the salary, which is already at 28,000 is going up to 37,000 and is thus an increase of only around 30%. "

Am I missing something, because the above is inconsistent with the current post. It seems you have overestimated the salary through double counting. It should be 37k for an Assistant prof inclusive of all allowances and not 60k as you claim.

Balaji Ramasubramanian said...

Btw, an engineering professor in the US in top schools can earn between USD 100k to USD 250k. This excludes fellowships and grants. In addition to that they get medical and dental coverage, spousal coverage, a sabbatical every few years, a good startup package of paid summers and less teaching load for the first few years. For women, there are additional advantages: guaranteed appointment of spouse in the same campus in most universities and maternity allowances. There is also a consideration in their tenure evaluation for maternity and such absence from research.

Btw, even female graduate students get maternity absence pay in some of the good schools like Berkeley and Illinois. Many other schools cover hospitalization and maternity care even if they don't pay for maternity absence. In Illinois, graduate student mothers and lactating graduate women are allowed upto three months of free pay. This applies even to women professors.

Of these, a significant number of allowances are open to even international graduate students though obviously not all allowances are.

The reason these things are very important is that life after graduation from college for most Indian women involves getting married and that is a significant barrier for graduate education and PhD. In fact many women I know of are married in the last few semesters in college and are actually studying for their final exams in a few days after their wedding. Even a lot of men in Indian villages get married by the time they are 26. People from the villages get married in two years after bachelors - they are actively looking for partners if they are doing their master's and as we know, a student earning a stipend of Rs. 8k is not a very attractive groom.

Thus it means that unless you are significantly motivated to pursue graduate education, and are interesting in only research and nothing else in life, you will not think of graduate education. Getting married and 'settling down' gains importance. And if you are really so motivated, you might as well go abroad to a good school. Why should you stay in India and get lousy pay and study in a university that is not as prestigious?

A professor in the US is paid really according to his teaching load and seniority. But the salary these people earn is not their only source of income either, just like in India.

To make a comparison between Indian professor's income and a professor in the US, we have to compare apples with apples. That means if you want to compare the total CTC of a professor in India, you should compare against the total income of professors in the US including consultancies, grants, travel allowances, awards, memberships and so much more (of which some are even tax-free).

The average engineering professor in the top 10-15 US schools should be compared with the engineering professor in IITs or IISc. You might say that this is a very small fraction of professors in the US - but no. The engineering faculty size of just Berkeley and Illinois exceeds that of the engineering faculty strength of all the IITs and IISc taken together. The average income tax paid by professors in top 15 schools is in excess of USD 100k p.a. In the top 5 schools some pay as much as USD 400k. p.a as income tax. That means their total annual income (not just salary) exceeds USD 1M. If we consider than some awards are tax free, the computation is even more complex. If you are married and your spouse needs an academic position too, then she often gets such a position and is paid a minimum of USD 70k p.a. and if she performs well, she can get paid even better.

For those reading this comment of mine, here is a caveat: this is not uniform across the US. The salaries and total annual incomes fall very very rapidly beyond the top 15 schools. Further, getting an academic position for international students is an uphill climb - so don't be so attracted.

If you are in the Indian government and are thinking of revising pay scales, remember that the US government is also revising its pay scales. They probably do it much faster and much more frequently than in India, and the inflation here is much lower. So please act fast and think of more innovative ways of attracting smart people to be professors in India.

Finally, even though I am reasonably attracted to apply for a position in IISc/IITs as a professor after my post-doc, when compared to the standard of living a professor in the US can afford, the pay scale in India still needs some more embellishments. Even if we say that such expectations are unreasonable and go to the point of obnoxious greed and restrict ourselves to IISc's current pay scale, it needs to be advertised much better.

Balaji Ramasubramanian said...

One more caveat for Indian students reading the above post. Don't be attracted to professor positions in the US so much. A lot depends on state funding and in this financial crisis a lot of schools located in "red" states (states that vote republican) have been significantly hit.

- University of Florida has laid off 10% of the faculty.
- Arizona State University has nearly completely shut down their engineering faculty.
- A lot of private universities in California have suffered losses and faculty pays have been cut.

Another caveat: if you go to a "red" state and to an unknown school, be aware that you are still considered colored. The Ku-klux clan in these states will take care of you! In fact even in "blue" states if you go to very small towns or villages, you have invited trouble. If you get a faculty position in missionary schools and Catholic foundations, you are probably going to have to sell your soul.

Life in the US is not a bed or roses. So don't be attracted so much by my last post.

Prof. Giri, you and a lot of others at IISc may be knowing very well that most of these professors that were laid off in these universities got 3 months worth of pay and continued medical and dental coverage for this year because the premium was already paid. Further many of them also got jobs in some good schools in the "blue" states. Even though the government of India does not cut professor jobs because of industry slowdowns, it does cut research grants.

That said, the retirement benefits in academic positions in India beats the industry black and blue. Surely that is very attractive. But if we compare the retirement benefits for professors in state-funded universities in the US, they are equally attractive. Retirement coverage in private US schools is not too much, but in state-funded schools, you can be very well off.

Thinking of Returning said...

Balaji,
In the US it is very hard for universities to fire tenured professors. Further the KKK is banned in the US, and universities are quite immigrant friendly even in the racist backwaters.

Thirdly the Sixty pay comission according to my knowledge has eliminated pension, for new faculty.

Balaji Ramasubramanian said...

"In fact even in "blue" states if you go to very small towns or villages, you have invited trouble."

Btw, the above is not true if you go to university towns. University towns are by far very liberal in outlook. So if you are professor in Purdue, Urbana, Berkeley or Princeton, you are relatively safer - just keep away from the politically agitated crowds of Berkeley.

I think in general life in India is safer - as long as you don't get onto the roads! So obviously that is an indirect salary being paid. But a few years back we even had a bomb blast inside IISc campus. Things are getting worse in Bangalore given the rising economic disparities.

The choice between the US and India is a very hard one. Think it through very carefully.

Balaji Ramasubramanian said...

"In the US it is very hard for universities to fire tenured professors."

True, but ASU has seen a very big hit. Don't underestimate the power of money and the damage the lack of it can cause.

"Further the KKK is banned in the US,..."

True, but if you go outside universities, you will feel the pinch. I went to a car resale place in a small town and had to use the restroom. People were staring at me because I did not ask them for permission. It is banned, but in villages and small towns where people are homogeneous, the racial ideologies continue.

"...universities are quite immigrant friendly even in the racist backwaters."

True. That is because they are university towns. But I agree with this point.

"Thirdly the Sixty pay comission according to my knowledge has eliminated pension, for new faculty."

Really!!? This is very very very bad. Obviously people that go abroad for research positions will no longer be attracted to the Rs. 95,000 p.m. salary that Prof. Giri advertised on his blog on behalf of IISc. Is the Indian government intent on driving smart people out of India?

Btw, Prof. Giri, one of my friends here jokes that Indians don't eat enough soy products even though Chinese do. He blames the Himalayas for that. If you go to the Himalayas, please let me know if you could get any soy products that could not make their way into India!! :) Cheers!

Thinking of Returning said...

Balaji,
While universities can fire tenured professors under extreme financial duress, I have not yet heard of such a case. It is likely that they are only laying off administrative staff, and probably (though unlikely) tenure track professors. Can you can point me to a news report where it says that tenured professors were fired.

Also I think Prof. Madras's estimations of new salaries in this post are inflated, see my first post in the comments here to see why.

Balaji Ramasubramanian said...

@TOR,

You are right about tenured professors.

http://www.azcentral.com/arizonarepublic/news/articles/2008/10/28/20081028asubudgetcuts1028.html

The above is a link of ASU's lay-offs. It does not specify if tenured professors are being laid off. But I don't think they would be.

Your point on inflated numbers on Prof. Giri's blog was my initial suspicious too. I don't want to comment on that, because I am not currently residing in India and don't want to make an uninformed statement. Besides, I am not the one earning Rs. 95,000 a month. So I can't speak for or against it. Yet if that is true, I'm very glad and attracted by it.

He also claims Rs. 14k for PhD students and Rs. 25k for post-doc fellows. I'm glad if that is true, but also note that I have shown that all these numbers are still quite low. Also if IISc really pays that much, I wonder why the students and fellows don't actually get so much.

A friend of mine in AMD with a master's from IISc wanted to do a PhD. He did not want to go abroad because he wanted to be close to his aging retired father - which is very nice. So he wanted to do it in IISc. However, after some digging, he found out and told me very sadly that the monthly pay is no more than Rs. 12k and he does not know if he still has to pay any admission or tuition fee. (This was in 2008) He is continuing in industry with the salary they pay there. That is lost talent for IISc. In a few years after getting married and providing well enough for his parents, this boy will think of going abroad - after-all why should he stay in India?

Balaji Ramasubramanian said...

Btw, Prof.

http://www.payscale.com/research/IN/School=IIT_Kanpur/Salary/show_all

The above link compares payscales in college/university with government scales and the scales in industry. These are median salaries and are taken across different types of employers. Note: University professors salaries mentioned there is of the order of Rs. 4.2 lakhs. This is data collected as of March 2009. The Federal government (IAS) as I said earlier pays slightly more, and the state government employee is paid even more.

The median salaries in industry however are twice that of the professors. The one problem with this chart is that it does not compare the age or experience level. I don't know what should the experience of a professor be to get 4.2 lakhs p.a. But from an earlier chart on the same page, we can see that in industry you can get 4.2 lakhs as a starting pay and can get double that much in just 4 years. Compare that against two years of master's degrees + three years of PhD + few more years in PhD because your prof is being a a**hole + few years in post-doc + few years struggling here and there because IISc or an IIT does not have an opening. Ok, even if we say that the comparison between industry and academia is unfair, consider that an average government officer has to serve in the state government for just 6 years (see this Wiki article for a chart of positions http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indian_Administrative_Service) and he will earn as much as a Deputy commissioner or an assistant professor.

Further, I meant to specifically say that professors are not paid commensurate to their qualifications. Do you mean to say that a professor is just as qualified as a corrupt lala Deputy commissioner in the state government or a Deputy Secretary in the central government?

Obviously the comparison has gone out of hand. So a good comparison is possible only between professors in the US and professors in India. And we just made the comparison in my comments above.

The UGC pay scale for teachers is here:
http://www.scribd.com/doc/6407876/UGC-6th-Pay-Scale-for-teachers

I don't see anything close to Rs. 95k over there. Somebody should explain this. Btw, Mr. thinking of returning, pension is not cancelled in academic positions in India - thankfully!

http://hubpages.com/hub/MHRD-Approves-UGC-Pay-Revision-New-UGC-Pay-Scales-Details

On this page, note the frustrated comments below.

So let's calculate the total pre-taxation salary of a new assistant professor (has spent about 8-9 years in various ways after graduation). Also note that the highest payment in this scale is to the "Professor of Eminence". (aged nearly 55, should be having kids my age if he had married in time) They are paid Rs. 80k and all this is before taxation.

A professor in Kanpur, Kharagpur, Indore and the new campus of IISc will be paid only 10% HRA. Also note that page 5, last line clarifies that LTC cannot be encashed unless availed of. Again, it is not specific about HRA and says that this is similar to other central government employees. We need to understand if all central government employees are paid HRA even when not living in quarters. I am not sure of this, but in the army and DRDO, they did not get it as of Dec 2007.

But guess what! Right at the end, the government says that people qualified as PhDs will have to pass a NET/SET examinations!! WOW! Really, India loves entrance exams. What position does not have an exam? Which century and imperialistic rule are we still living in? It's amazing that the government thinks that there is no way to identify smart applicants for academic positions. They have no better way of identifying smart professors. I hate these entrance exam policies. Ridiculous that even a PhD will have to take written tests!!

Balaji Ramasubramanian said...

Ok. Sorry, PhDs don't have to take NET/SET - thankfully. But this examination policy is not at all good.

Balaji Ramasubramanian said...

Hey! There are really some good things in this pay commission man. The Adjunct professor position seems interesting - quite a copy of the US, but still commendable.

The interesting thing is paternity leave. I don't think this is offered in any position in industry! But the point to be noted is that a person in a professor's position would probably be having kids already. Maternity and paternity leaves should be extended to graduate students and post-docs too!

Giri@iisc said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Giri@iisc said...

Dear Balaji,

It is unfortunate to know that your brother is paying Rs. 24 K as the tution fees because all other students are paying only 9 K for masters and 12 K for Ph.D per annum. It is also so unfortunate that is receiving is only 8 K as scholarship when all others are receiving Rs 14 K for doing Ph.D in material engineering.

Please ask him to meet me with the scholarship receipts and fee payment vouchers. We will take it at the highest level and make sure justice is done.

Thanks

Giridhar

Giri@iisc said...

Please do not accuse me of double counting and grade inflation without understanding what is written. The basic has gone up from 28,000 to 37,000, as mentioned here and in that post also. Add to this, DA of 22%, HRA of 30%, travelling Allowance (TA): 3,200 + 15% of DA
academic Allowance : 1,500, telephone : 1,500. There are also other allowances, which if you add will come to around 55 K. If you feel any of this is wrong, please tell me which allowance is wrong and where is the double counting.

Take the basic of the professor, count all the allowances like the above and see whether the numbers are off. Then specifically tell me where the numbers are off.

Giri@iisc said...

Balaji,

A ph.d student in engg gets Rs. 14 K every month for the first two years and Rs. 15 K every month for the next three years. For science Ph.D, the scholarships are 12 K and 14 K, respectively.

For students who are doing M.E/M.Tech/M.Sc (engg), the scholarship is 8 K.

Integrated Ph.D students who join with B.Sc qualification get Rs 8K for the first two years (this is like doing masters) and then Rs 12 K (which is like the science students who do a Ph.D after M.Sc) for two more years and then Rs 14 K.

If your brother is indeed doing a ph.d (and not a masters or an integrated ph.d) in material science in IISc and getting only 8 K, ask him to either meet me or the deputy registrar (academic). We will resolve the issue by this evening.

Thanks

Giridhar

Balaji Ramasubramanian said...

I see... I did not know about these gradations. This is good info. He said that he has now been interviewed and has been admitted to a PhD. Neither did he specify if it was a integrated program nor did I ask. I just asked if he got an increment and he told me he would perhaps get an increment to upto about 12k. But I think you clarified the matter. Thanks. He must be in integrated PhD program.

About the fees, I am sure he told me that it is Rs. 24k. I shall call him up and if it is the case, he should be contacting you. Otherwise, please consider that this was my misinformation.

Sorry for the misrepresentation of the figures then. This is very wrong on my part. I stand corrected. About salaries, I checked Prof. Giri's numbers and though UGC scales are lower than what he quotes I saw another document for new payscales for IITs and IISc. I did not check it thoroughly, but I believe that must match Prof. Giri's numbers.

As I said earlier, this is surely an attractive salary as per Indian living standards today. I'll soon update these comments however with information on the salaries paid to PhDs in industry in India.

Nevertheless, it may be noted that the adjunct professor position is new - this is advantageous for the doctorates in India. So even if other positions pay better, I think prof. payscales are attractive now IF THE NEW PAYSCALE IS APPROVED. Also, such a good salary should be well advertised.

Balaji Ramasubramanian said...

Ok, the Rs. 24k was right but only for the first year. It includes hostel fee, security deposits etc. I don't think it is Rs. 24k next year, but my brother was not sure. I think he just didn't find out.

At this point, I'm inclined to take Prof. Giri's word as correct.

I shall have a word with my brother to inform me properly rather than give me such blanket information about money matters. Sorry for the confusion.

Giri@iisc said...

If your brother joined IISc with a B.Sc degree, he is in the integrated Ph.D program, if he joined with a M.Sc degree, he must be getting 12,000 and if he joined with a M.Tech, he will get 14,000.

There is no way that your brother would have paid 24 K as fees, including refundable fees.

If you include all refundable payment, it is only 16 K. Look at

http://www.iisc.ernet.in/admissions/chapter4.htm

Anonymous said...

Dear Prof. Madras, Thank you very much for painstakingly collecting and presenting all this information on your blog in a very concise manner. I will appreciate it if you could clarify some more issues. I am an academician in Canada, planning to move back to India, and I think the new IIT/IISc pay scales are more than fair to those who have understood the fact that by coming to academia one is voluntarily choosing a lower paying position for the sake of intellectual/job satisfaction. In particular, the benefit of living in one's home country, close to family, simply cannot be measured in terms of money. However, I think the catch may be the details of the medical benefits. I have heard that India is now basically as expensive (in relative terms) as US/Canada for medical treatment. If the medical benefits for IIT/IISc faculty, and their dependents, do not apply after retirement then that can make a HUGE difference - big enough to be the difference between solvency and bankruptcy in cases where some family members may have serious medical complications requiring regular treatments. Based, on what you know, could you elaborate on the specific details of the medical coverage for IIT/IISc faculty members? Once again, thanks for sharing all this information! Regards, RD.

Giri@iisc said...

Look at

http://www.healthinsuranceindia.org/

It will cost you around 20,000 a year

Anonymous said...

Thank you very much! Regards, RD

vivekanand said...

hello sir,
i m a btech08 batch with ECE
this is 1st time i will gonna try for gate
i want 2 know that wat is the minimum marks i needed to get admission in iisc and top iits
and in pencentile also .........
hoping i will b answered soon thanking you.......

purist969 said...

Giri
You have a good following- I suggest you lobby with fellow serous academicians to get tax free life for all academicians PLUS free medical and education for family. You deserve it.
I remember when I was studying engineering- an asst prof used to be paid only 5.5 K. Poor guys had to travel by bus and wear cheap sandals- while most of us whizzed past in our father sponsored cars. I am from Anna University and this happened only 18 years ago.
My argument is that precisely becos of all these sacrificing individuals many Indian engineers are millionaires today the world over. Yet- I still am unable to forget the face of my asst prof who used to teach QC and knowing so much- and to think that most of us were not listening. I feel bad now. Pls post me as anonymous- simply because people will know who I am- I do not want any publicity please.

Anonymous said...

Sorry frds,
First of all, i like to clarify many things about salary in US/Canada.Real thing always seem to be unclear and we guys blindly follow to what we hear from other. As said by few people abt the salary of prof. to be 100K to 225k/ annum, i like to admit that i am studying phd in Canada and did part of studies in US too. So i know what is actual figure . Actually, tax in US-Cnada is around 40%. Also all food and other items charge 15%. thus , u people lose roughly 50-55% from ur salary/earning.Also, salary for prof. is around 100k AND IF he/she is excellent, then only u get upto 225k/annum . that excellence you can show in India too and see the wonders. U will earn more than US prof. Also many prof. here depend alot on projects which i think is best idea. Projects r also industry sponsored , so it he heavly paid. No need to worry for money.So if u r venturesome, even u can achieve success here.
Regards and thanks to prof.
Vinayak Narulkar

Anonymous said...

Sir,

I wish to know about the opportunities that are open to postdoctoral students after they have completed a postdoc from IISC primarily in the Computer Science and Automation Department.

I would really appreciate if you could share some insight on this.

chaluva said...

Phd holders no doubt would have put more effort . A simple graduate in engineering joining any IT industry will certainly be getting salary in lakhs by the time one comes out with Phd.
Why not the pay fixers/ Govt think of a good reasonable salary for compensating for the period of doing their Phd. Having put best, hard effort and joining for a salary lessthan what his otherwise BE classmate getting , will this not really put one in to frustration?